Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Wed May 28, 2014 6:28 pm


May 27, 2014
J1ndo

Country: USA



I'm not sure the reason for Tern's silence, but I feel pretty confident that it's going to persist. If they haven't announced anything of substance in the past six months, then they likely won't ever do so.

This leads me to think that the problem is so big that it risks bankrupting Tern, or more simply that they just don't really care all that much about the problem, or your peace of mind, or your safety. I feel bad for Tern owners, but I'm grateful now that I'm not one.

If anyone from Tern happens to still be reading this, just know that I was ready to give you $1250 for a bike, and was excited to do so. Not anymore, and likely not ever. And I'm probably not the only sale you lost. And, if anyone asks my opinion about buying a Tern, I'll send them here.

Good luck with your silence.

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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Wed May 28, 2014 8:18 pm


May 28, 2014 - 4:54am
brdevine

Country: UK


J1ndo wrote:

I'm not sure the reason for Tern's silence, but I feel pretty confident that it's going to persist. If they haven't announced anything of substance in the past six months, then they likely won't ever do so.

This leads me to think that the problem is so big that it risks bankrupting Tern, or more simply that they just don't really care all that much about the problem, or your peace of mind, or your safety. I feel bad for Tern owners, but I'm grateful now that I'm not one.

If anyone from Tern happens to still be reading this, just know that I was ready to give you $1250 for a bike, and was excited to do so. Not anymore, and likely not ever. And I'm probably not the only sale you lost. And, if anyone asks my opinion about buying a Tern, I'll send them here.

Good luck with your silence.


I'm pretty much in the same position as you. I was looking to purchase either a Verge X20 or P9 but I've been holding off until Tern release some information stating the issue and precisely what bikes in the range are affected. The whole debacle just seems to be dragging on now and with each day that passes, my faith in the safety of their products diminishes. With no news from the company at all, it's increasingly looking like I will just need to choose an alternative bike from one of their competitors.


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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Fri May 30, 2014 6:33 pm


May 28, 2014
Plne


Country: New Zealand


J1ndo wrote:

I'm not sure the reason for Tern's silence, but I feel pretty confident that it's going to persist. If they haven't announced anything of substance in the past six months, then they likely won't ever do so.

This leads me to think that the problem is so big that it risks bankrupting Tern, or more simply that they just don't really care all that much about the problem, or your peace of mind, or your safety. I feel bad for Tern owners, but I'm grateful now that I'm not one.


Yes, I suspect that the problem is bigger than their bottom line can deal with and they simply have been hoping it will go away. I'm surprised at how badly they've handled it from a pr point of view. Why haven't they got in a pr company to help them work their way through it? Do they not want to get anyone else involved?

And Steve, I appreciate you have a lot of goodwill towards Tern, but myself and others simply don't trust their product at this point. It is not good enough to say 'don't hold your breath' - or words to that effect. Tern is shooting themselves in the foot with their response here. And more to the point they are going to be very lucky if a customer doesn't get seriously hurt.

I would speculate that the problem with the welds is impossible to isolate and they're not sure how to proceed other than to recall an impossibly large number of bikes. Or, at least, impossibly large from their perspective.



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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Fri May 30, 2014 6:34 pm


May 28, 2014
SpeedUno

Country: Japan



As a Tern owner, I’ve been monitoring this forum since it was posted.

I have just one concern regarding where Tern bikes are being manufactured / welded. My bike has a sticker under the bottom bracket that says it is Made in Taiwan, but after reading the posts below I got confused. Was it made in China and then assembled in Taiwan?

There just seem to be an inconsistency on these posts. Aren’t all Physis handleposts and OCL frame joints being made/built/ manufactured/welded in Taiwan and not in other parts of the world including China?

Re-tern wrote:


I have had one call from Mark frm Tern, who stated exactly the same to me as he did to Lee, "probably a bad weld and we don't use the factory anymore". Not commited to saying this in writing though, and to be honest "probably"is not a good enough explanation to me. I do know it was a bad weld, due to a number of reasons, but Mark also stated the bike was made in one of their Chinese factories, so why did my bike state "Made in Taiwan" on the bottom?

josh.hon wrote:
Jeff - glad you are enjoying the bike. We assemble our bikes in China, Taiwan, Thailand and the Czech Republic. All Physis handleposts and OCL frame joints are manufactured in Taiwan. As you said, assembly quality coming from our China factory is pretty good.


Please enlighten me on this.

And of course, like all other Tern owners and or prospective owners, I 'm also waiting for Tern to give us the result of their investigation (at most June.21, 2014 (6 months after the first broken frame was reported), as proposed by Keith) regarding this breaking-in-half issue. Please tell us whether or not it is still safe to ride our bikes.


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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Fri May 30, 2014 6:34 pm


May 29, 2014
bugaboosun

Country: USA



I submitted a reasonable comment to this forum yesterday. The comment went to the moderator abut has never been posted. Is anyone else experiencing this?

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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Fri May 30, 2014 6:35 pm


May 29, 2014
oldjoey

Country: USA



Well, to add to the confusion, I just received a Tern Eclipse S11i and the sticker on the bb said: Made in Viet Nam!

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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Fri May 30, 2014 6:35 pm


May 29, 2014
Rager

Country: France


bugaboosun wrote:

I submitted a reasonable comment to this forum yesterday. The comment went to the moderator abut has never been posted. Is anyone else experiencing this?

I think this is an automatic function on the forum - some posts have to be approved. It's happened to me. I may be wrong but I don't think the moderators are selecting your posts.

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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Fri May 30, 2014 6:37 pm


May 30, 2014
Keith C. Johns



Country: USA


Steveroot wrote:

Rager wrote:

Steve, How long do you suggest we wait? It's now almost 6 months.

I think you may be waiting for an event that will never happen. "Closure" is a nice concept, but it may not apply here. What the explanation for this is I have no idea. But, like the Second Coming, I'm not holding my breath.

Steve

If they do not bring closure to this issue, they will inevitably bring closure to this thread or even this forum. I am still holding out hope that they are really just conducting a VERY thorough examination of this issue. And that they DO intend to report here their findings and remedies to all of our satisfaction. I hope that this can be completed within what I consider to be a reasonable six month period ending June 21, 2014. I can not get into their mindset on this issue because we are speculating about many of the facts and their motives for what appears to be inaction. I just hope it is not truly inaction but just hidden action. Like Steve, I am willing to bide my time for now and allow them the slack they need to complete their thorough examination.

However, I am not willing to hold in abeyance my need for closure indefinitely. The Second Coming of Christ has many waiting for centuries now, but they hope for a powerful payout when it occurs. But people who want to know if they are buying a safe and dependable bicycle must have a resolution within a considerably shorter time span than that. I suggest that they may need to consider alternatives if this is not forthcoming from this company. But still, I want to give Tern a chance to come through. Six months for a thorough investigation is not unreasonable. But longer stretches credulity.

I want to give Tern another option here short of an all-out recall which may bankrupt them: if the issues which have caused these failures are not easily discernable, and they are just aberrations in the manufacturing process, and most Tern bikes never will fail, so the safety issue reduces to a statistical anomaly, then at least fully redeem any to whom it occurs. Offer a complete refund plus all medical expenses plus something for any inconvenience. If these occurances truly are random and statistically insignificant, this will cost the company very little overall, and reassure anyone who has experienced a failure. It has proven to be extremely poor PR to leave these people to twist in the wind here. It would be money well spent to simply immediately make this handfull of people whole here without any further ado. I hope they consider this option and act on it right away.

Meanwhile, I recommend we all give them time to finish their investigations and have faith until at least June 21, 2014.



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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Fri May 30, 2014 6:38 pm


May 29, 2014
Rager

Country: France



Keith, let's hope you're right about a proper investigation being carried out. However, I have to say, the failure to report on this forum certainly does not inspire confidence. This is an 'official' forum yet we're seeing recommendations for rival brands and potential customers turning away. Yet Tern does nothing. I fear these are all very ominous signs... I hope I will be proven wrong - and that my bike, like everybody's - is safe to ride.

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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Fri May 30, 2014 6:39 pm


May 29, 2014
thor



Country: USA

Every better company has a product liability insurance. In case there is any problems with a product than the insurance company will tell you right away, that if you say, do, post, breathe, anything, they will not cover anything.

Its common knowledge, frustating but unfortunately most likely the reason you dont hear nothing "official" at this time.


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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Fri May 30, 2014 6:40 pm


May 29, 2014
Steveroot

Country: USA



thor wrote:

Every better company has a product liability insurance. In case there is any problems with a product than the insurance company will tell you right away, that if you say, do, post, breathe, anything, they will not cover anything.

I'm willing to accept this. My lawyer acquaintances tell me the same thing. It doesn't give the feeling of "closure", but it explains the current state of affairs.

Steve

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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Fri May 30, 2014 6:40 pm


May 30, 2014
LeisureCyclist

Joined: 2014-05-29
Country: Singapore



I am looking for a foldable bike. So far, the list includes Tern D8 and Dahon Falcon. After browsing and read all the comments, I decided to put D8 on hold first (pending the report). If nothing is reported, then I am going for the Dahon Falcon.

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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Fri May 30, 2014 6:41 pm


May 30, 2014
Keith C. Johns



Country: USA

Steveroot wrote:

thor wrote:

Every better company has a product liability insurance. In case there is any problems with a product than the insurance company will tell you right away, that if you say, do, post, breathe, anything, they will not cover anything.

I'm willing to accept this. My lawyer acquaintances tell me the same thing. It doesn't give the feeling of "closure", but it explains the current state of affairs.

Steve


What you are describing is akin to a defendant sitting in the courtroom and keeping his mouth shut because his lawyers have advised him to do so, in spite of every testimony by witnesses for the prosecution. It must be extremely hard for Tern to have to stand back and be gagged from saying anything in their defense on their own forum!

Okay, if this is the real reason for the radio silence here, and not just too hard at work on the solution, the question becomes, "How long must they be gagged?" I'll stick to my six month expectation until told what the statute is. Another calculation for how long they must keep silent might be, "Stay silent until the insurance is paid out, or the silence itself causes more damage than any possible benefit to be derived from insurance." There is always a choice.

And BTW, does it risk anything to say, "We appreciate your support and patience while we sort out all the facts of this issue, and reiterate that we are not ignoring this situation but actively engaged on it, but for legal reasons can not currently disclose more than this. Thank you for your support." That sounds better than, "........."

Or better yet, say, "We will be able to share what we have learned on [future date]." This would eliminate the despair of thinking that those with broken frames have been abandoned and will forever be ignored. Give them something to aim for. Lawyers work with deadlines, too. Let us know what date is the reveal date, if there will ever be one, please.

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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Mon Jun 02, 2014 6:23 pm


May 31, 2014
vavavoom

Country: Greece



Keith and Thor,

If insurance companies are the reason for this radio silence, then I would like to make some points.

Up to now, what we see on this forum is a direct blow to the company's public profile:

1. There are customers who have posted pictures of the failed bikes

2. There are potential customers who have openly expressed their decision to not buy a bike DUE to the company's attitude

3. There are customers who are openly considering of taking legal action against the company

4. There are customers who are openly expressing their concern for their health and integrity while using the product and have received no official warnings to stop using it.

5. There is a competitor who is openly taking advantage of the situation and has also launched a new thread on a different forum, in case this one gets shut down.

6. Almost everybody is expressing their dissapointment with the company's after sales support

7. Almost everybody is speculating in various directions, some of which are really bad for the company's image

8. This and the other forum are accesible to thousands and thousands of prospective customers



If insurance companies are the case, then they would be exposing Tern to damage on their public image, their corporate social responsibility and their relationship with their clients.

So, I believe that there should be some kind of a legal loophole to this... something. The above facts are more than enough to support the notion that Tern need to defend themselves. The problem is exponentialy rising to such a point, where the damage to their public image is becoming disproportionaly larger than the issue itself (the broken frames).

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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

Post by Admin on Mon Jun 02, 2014 6:24 pm


June 1, 2014
Keith C. Johns



Country: USA


vavavoom wrote:

...If insurance companies are the case, then they would be exposing Tern to damage on their public image, their corporate social responsibility and their relationship with their clients.

So, I believe that there should be some kind of a legal loophole to this... something. ...



Exactly. They must be allowed to at least "Calm the crowd" with some encouraging comments that hint at the near future remedies.

And even if there is some threat by their insurers against making any comments, surely there is no admission of fault if they make a good will gesture as I have previously suggested, such as immediately refunding the purchase price of the few bikes which have failed to date.

The only reason not to do thus would be a prelude to bankruptcy where they anticipate that EVERY bike is going to come back broken eventually and destroy the finances of the company. We have no reason to suspect such a bleak scenario, but perhaps their silence is an indication that they do see such an outcome as likely. Again we see the danger in radio silence here, because we are left to speculate and guess why no new information has appeared yet.

But as Samual Clemens said, "The reports of my death have been premature," it is too soon to anticipate such dire outcomes. I am still awaiting June 21 to give Tern the full six months before I think anyone ought to cry foul. I think they ARE working on this and plan to come out shortly with some announcement. Keep the faith folders!

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Re: Tern Link D8 frame shearing in two

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